Gearbox Failure: Tenere died... Possible clutch or even gearbox
 

So today my tenere has died on me in spectacular way...
During some moderate fast offroading, on acceleration through some bumps she has made a noise and lock the rear wheel, like chain come off.... naturally i have pull the clutch and stop, then i was trying to find neutral, at this point when i press on the lever bike has made awful grinding noise and then become quiet and revved up... so i stop the engine, and checked the chain... all good.
Try to start the bike, and despite neutral light on she was on gear (?!!) also clutch seems to not work... I have try to down shift to 1st gear and start the engine, just to get out off the green lane to main road... starts and start going slowly on 1st gear........ after about 5 meters loud bang and bike stall... since then starter wouldn't even spin the crankshaft - its like hitting something with loud metallic noise.
I think something is really messed up :-(
There is no neutral, to push the bike you need to pull the clutch.
What you think guys??? - gearbox or something with piston?

I'm not sure, but when pulling the clutch releases the rear wheel it shoud be a problem between clutch and piston. As far as I know the clutch is located between crankshaft and gearbox.

The only way to be sure is to open the engine

Cia�
Solitario

Sounds expensive, you will need to strip the motor, stop trying to start the motor you could be causing further damage, pull the clutch cover off first ^ check the main crank gear & nut.

I know, it sounds grim... i will start from taking off clutch cover, and see there first. If this will look OK, then stripping the engine, and to be honest i'm not that confident in this type of work. Cylinder, cylinder head i'm ok with, but splitting engine in half it's too much for me :-(
Will probably go for buying second hand engine and swapping, or selling bike as non runner :-(

If you can pull the head off an overhead cam engine then may I suggest at least have a go at splitting the cases if that is whats required. Think of the knowledge you'll gain and with google and XT660.com as your friends what have you got to lose? It sounds a daunting task but with the right methodical approach its amazing what you can achieve. Good luck mate.

Sent from my MB526 using Tapatalk 2

I wonder if it's a problem as reported earlier on the forum - maybe the shift drum stopper bearing has failed with fatal consequences to third gear.

Scary to hear! I hope all goes well for you.
I read somewhere that it would be advisable to replace that stopper around 50k. So I replaced mine , the bearing was fine and seemed well, but the arm was bent. Also changed the chain tensioner. Makes me wonder about the reliability of the engine as my last bike was ridden hard for twenty years.

Thank you for your good words :-) Will see in what mood i will be when it comes to stripping.

Do you have to split the engine to replace this stopper?


More i read about this it's more possible it's this...

I recover the bike yesterday (it was in someone back garden until i organize a van) and play around a bit.

My conclusion was - clutch works ok, i even managed to find the neutral playing with gear change lever (it felt very "wonky")... Interesting thing was - when on second or third gear (can't tell as shifting the gear was pretty messed up) you can push the bike without pulling a clutch (!!!) It feels "heavy" but there is no contact with piston or crank as its smooth (you can't feel or hear piston travel).

Good luck mate and let us know how it goes!!!!

You just have to take the crankcase cover off on the clutch side. It's well documented in the manual and easy.

Decision made... shopping around for KTM 690 Enduro R begins... In the mean time without the rush i will try to sell Tenere as a non runner. Shame, as i was very happy with Tenere until she proves that biggest selling point over KTM - reliability - it's only a myth.

Shame about your Tenere... fix it & yer have a reliable bike...
The 690 is a good bike..but are not without there issues...

+1. As a matter of research (!) I looked at a 690 forum. Seems to me they have their own raft of problems, like a percentage of every brand.

Bad that your Tenere has gone wrong - the above comment doesn't help that issue much.

I wonder if the shift drum stopper bearing fails due to inevitable falling down issues on the trail. There must be a reason other than general crappiness, because some owners don't seem to have the problem even after big miles.

To be honest i was riding rather aggressive offroad... with some jumping and hard accelerations over harsh bumps which was putting loads of force over the rear wheel - clutch - gearbox. Many of my riding mates has said that they never seen someone on this type of bike riding so fast off road. Looks like i was having a wrong tool to my type of work. But then again - it wasn't rallying...
And i know - all bikes has their own problems, and i can understand that. I can cope with electrical regulator fault, with rear shock going bad after 20000 or other issues, but gearbox... That is a bit too much for me.
Now i got a real big problem - 690 is too small (i like bigger bikes) 990 had a long list of common issues and f800GS sounds and look grim... Still think Tenere is the best dual sport bike and i was planning to stay with her for at least two more years (even spend 530 quid on proper service with trusted mechanic two weeks before she decided to blow). :icon_neutral:

Yes, it's a shame that a cheap part failing causes so much damage.

Would hard riding damage the shift drum locator? I don't really know, but it seems unlikely. Others here will know more than me, though.

Could it be the nut on the crank shaft coming loose perhaps???? I would not sell it as a non runner cos you will get peanuts.......Always worth fixing.

Think outside the box - fit a 690 ktm engine into the xt660z!

Already take out right hand crank case cover - crank nut is nice and tight with washer bend on on one side preventing to loosen up.

That is actually very good idea :-) But for someone with good garage equipment and some welding skills... and offcourse lot of money as this wont be cheap.
... it would make a cracking bike, but will have to stick some decent WP forks and rear shock. But then - is it not cheaper to buy 690 enduro and chuck some rally raid tank/fairing kit?


In regards to 690 enduro - i have done a test ride on it last saturday.
In the end i didn't fall in love due to couple of things:

- small... i know - small means lighter and this is better, but God, how i love the size of tenere :-(

- traction on the tarmac - due to light weight and off road tires this bike traction on tarmac was totally rubbish. From 70MPH front end gets very light and catch the shimmy even on a straight road... I have a TKC 80 on my tenere on the front, and yes - it was bad, but not as bad as with 690.

So now i have a big problem - get 690 and stick some rally raid fairing on it or get 990 adventure...

Expensive
 

My friend has just bought a 690 (he's not actually taken delivery of it yet), but I can tell you from his research that Rally Raid fairing, larger tanks and maybe a more comfortable seat all adds up to a very large cost! I think the tanks are �800 and the fairing was something crazy like �1500.

He's going to try it in standard form first and see how he gets on, but I have a feeling he will end up spending big in the end.... Or wishing he'd saved a tonne of cash and bought a Tenere like me :-)

I won't mention the flighty ride to him just yet but will be interested to see what he thinks when he gets it.

It is expensive, but for cost of 990 Adventure i can have 690 + rally kit.
Together with painting and graphics rally kit will cost around 1800-1900 pounds.
Bike for around 5000 and for 7000 we have rally bike replica. Yes - my Tenere was 4000 pounds and with mods maybe 4500, but... didn't stand abuse in the end :-(
Trouble is... still haven't make up my mind what i want :-)

Oh, one more thing - my mates are blaming me for blowing the gearbox for not changing oil enough often - i was sticking to manufacturer guidance and i have change my oil after 6000 miles (fully synthetic Motul 10W40 and then fully synthetic Silkolene 10W40)... They saying with my style of riding i should change oil after 2-3k... what you think guys?

The Rally Raid EVO 2 tanks and fairing with a set of graphics is about �2000. Nothing needs painting, panels come with gel coat in 2/3 different colours and graphics go straight on.

This adds 10kg (without fuel) the the front of the bike which balances the bike out nicely. I have difficulty telling if my bike is empty or full of fuel, it feels the same. If the front end still feels loose there is a facility within the headstock to change the rake by 2 deg which adds further stability.

My bike is rock solid at the front, never had any headshake or feeling of lightness in the front end, that is with the standard rake.

I'm interested to know where the 690 is to small. Do you mean between the seat and the pegs? There are lower pegs available.

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/m...psgl6lsp6r.jpg


Nick.

Did you ever think about completly changing the engine, there are a few on fleebay for a price that you paid for a service. (opt for international search)
We do have very good expirience with semi sythetic oil , i.e. Motul 3100 or 5100 on our Tour-XT�s. 100.000 km are no problem at all.
Personaly, i change every 5000 km and filter every 10.000 due to poor fuel quality in the Andes, never ever any gear box issues.

cheers,
Joe

Hi Joe, At the moment plan is to strip the engine, and see if it's repairable. I can't do this due to limited experience, but one of my mates back in Poland offer help, so i will take engine out, stick in to my car boot and take with me to Poland. If it's beyond repair then plan B is to buy second hand engine.
Everything only to sell the bike though...

Hi Nick, thanks for a great input:-)
I was considering rally raid kit, but it's a matter of taste, and i prefer look of this set:

http://www.albertodottori.net/ktm%20...ica%20race.htm

This set looks like proper dakar replica, and unpainted cost 1600 pounds. With paint and some graphic it will cost around 1800-1900.

Rally raid kit is made from better material and overall finish is very good from what i have research, also spare parts are cheaper (one side of rally raid tank as a spare part is 100 quid and one side tank from Italy is 460). But... Italian set is just prettier when properly fitted...

And in regards to 690 size - my biggest problem is the front of the bike. After riding Tenere which is in the size of pregnant cow i have sit on the 690 and... bike has disappeared... it was only me and the power :-) The fact that there is not much of the fairing at the front and no tank is creating impression that you riding nuclear powered pushbike :-) I know it's in my head, and i want two impossible things going together - big size and good offroad capabilities - this is why i'm struggling so much to make a choice between 690 and 990.

I've not seen one personally, but I understand there is a lot of work required to fit/finish the Dotorri fairings.

Have you seen the kit from Australia?

http://www.dalbymoto.com.au/adventur...00rr-exclusive


Nick.

shoot, engine failure??? that not what I'd expect from yamaha... :(

how come it is advertised as bullet proof engine...

It is bullet proof, mate. Just sh*t happens sometimes.

what year was that bike from and how many miles on it?

2009. 12400 miles. Regular service and oil change. Last one 400 miles ago... :-(
Run on fully synthetic 10W40 oils.

I'm not sure if its a lot of work, according to manufacturer set comes with everything needed to fit to the bike, so shouldn't be too much. Painting - yes it could be difficult but my mate is running paintshop so it will be cheaper for me. I think biggest problem with Dottori set is price of replacement parts. On other hand low fender cost only 150 pound and comes with all fixings, while rally raid low fender comes without fixings and fixings are quite expensive from what i remember.

Australian set looks good, but price is rather unacceptable for me.

Trying to organize trip to see 990 ADV this saturday... Still not sure what to do - heart telling me 690, but brain saying 990 ADV :-(

[IMG] http://i2.fmix.pl/fmi2181/bbadddfb00189d6853b0a09a[/IMG]

New bike! With limited amount of green lanes available in my area and lot of tarmac i'm doing i have choose big option. So far so good - ater setting the suspension to "sport" bike is handling like a road bike on the tarmac and offroad when dry i can go faster then on my tenere... in the mud i'm expecting some problems as power is quite brutal. But will see, its still on Pirelli scorpions but planning to change for mitas E07.

Tenere engine will be stripped down in August with help of my friend. I will let you know what will be the outcome of this operation.

hey, nice bike! wonder what is KTM reliability when compared to yamaha.
How is the handling? center of gravity good?

I have done some research and i know common issues and none of them scared me more then my broken down gearbox in my Yamaha :-)

In regards to handling - very different bike then Tenere - because center of gravity is low it handles like a road bike on the tarmac. Plus the power - more then enough. On tenere with my preffered speed on tarmac i was using pretty much 90-100% of the power all time... here i'm using abut 70% for normal fast twisties. Oh... and it does power wheelies from the 2nd gear :-)

In offroad - It looks lower and heavier then Tenere, and overall less offroadie. But... it's only about 10 kilo's heavier and suspension travel is the same on the front and even better (by only 10mm) at the back. Plus its WP suspension fully adjustable.
It requires different riding technique - Tenere was going through pretty much everything with the front suspension, and it was bottoming very often with rear due to poor shock and 17 inches wheel.
KTM if it will bottom down it will be with front, as more weight seems to be on the front and rear seems to be more stiff.

So when riding tenere you can do late braking and you don't want to go through deep holes on power as rear will struggle.
On KTM you have to brake on time as if too late and you hit the hole with brakes on - front fork might bottom out.
On KTM you want to slow down, and then go full power through the problem lightening the front - rear WP shock with 18 inches wheel will stand every abuse.
All in all - i can be faster offroad on KTM. Even if i go same speed it will feel faster as you going full on and rear don't complaining when front is very light at this point :-)

But there is a bad point - its expensive (mine is 1 year old with only 2700 miles) so you tend to avoid green lanes more often :-( And if you drop it - psychological pain is bigger.

Agree
 

"But there is a bad point - its expensive (mine is 1 year old with only 2700 miles) so you tend to avoid green lanes more often :-( And if you drop it - psychological pain is bigger."

This is one of the main reasons why I traded down from a �10,000 BMW to a �4000 Tenere. I have already taken the Ten places I would not take the BMW simply because I didn't want to drop the BMW or otherwise impact its resale value. I feel liberated!!

That's not to knock your choice though. Enjoy the KTM. It's an awesome machine and I've ridden with people who love theirs on and off road.

motul 15/50:happy birthday:

???

This happened to me yesterday (as also stated here).

http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/a...pshtyovymj.jpg

http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps7sgeyv00.jpg

http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/a...psgqnnuif6.jpg

This is some serious damage there :-/