Autotune switch - .: XT660.com

dazmatic · # 1 03-08-10, 21:30

Well, currently, because I've got an autotune with my PC5 on my bike, I really needed a switch to be able to switch between map and learn mode.

Especially if I'd had it in learn mode and been out for a ride, if I turn the ignition off, the map trims the Autotune had made were all lost!

However, by having a switch somewhere accesible on the bike I can switch between the 2 on the fly AND when the bike is in learn mode, I can save the trims to the base map by turning it off rather than losing the trims everytime.

Sooo... I got 1 of the little ABS boxes I bought from RS for about �1, a switch I just happened to find laying around and some -VERY- special stainless steel braided fibre coated 2 core wire that was going to go to scrap and made up a nice little box switch...

Just need somewhere to mount it now...

dazmatic · # 2 06-08-10, 11:17

Tadaa... done it!

First thing this morning

Looks fairly suiting I think, and the stainless braided wire looks ace too.

XT660 sticker!

My very Dirty Iggle Piggle

richardsracingmad · # 3 06-08-10, 11:50

nice one Daz....i don't fully understand the autotune, but it looks the biz mate!! nicely thought out.....

i hope this is even more significant to your recent testing!!!

Kev · # 4 06-08-10, 12:02

Nice work mate, at least you can now switch maps.

I find it handy being able to switch between fuel maps while riding, mine can store 5 different maps at one time.

Auto tune allows the rider to build their own fuel maps automatically, so no dyno time needed.

dazmatic · # 5 06-08-10, 12:11

Well, basically, the autotune uses a wideband O2 sensor rather than a narrowband O2 sensor like what the bike comes with.

It uses the sensor to detect the AFR thats being produced and then directly taps into the PCV's trim table to produce fuel adjustments depending on the RPM, throttle position etc.

Then, you can go into the PCV software and accept the trim tables manually which will add them to the base map which I've got to admit, is a pain in the bloody ars3!

If you don't accept the trims, the base map will never be changed and so the new map wont be applied.

What the switch does, by having it turned on, the autotune is in learn mode and making adjustments in the trim table and I believe is applying them to the running of the bike. When you switch it off, it then applies this trims to the base map saving you from having to hook up a laptop to accept them.

Thats my understanding anyway.

richardsracingmad · # 6 06-08-10, 12:15

Just had a shufty on the Dynojet site...it is an incredible bit of kit!! Surely a must-have for Kev ???? Mind you, you already have that Wideband part of it. An initial big outlay, but would save you alot of time too ( i've noticed how well mapped your maps are Kev!).

Now, i know we are not talking R1 performance on this site, but, I wonder if there is ANY "ram air" effect on a stage 3 DNA Airbox? This bit of kit would show it wouldn't it?

dazmatic · # 7 06-08-10, 12:20

Kev doesn't need the autotune because he's got the Wideband commander.

It's basically an autotune with bells and whistles

And no, there wouldn't be any Ram Air effect with the Stage 3.
Bikes with Ram air such as old FZR's and some ZX's I believe, work by having a couple of air ducts that run from the airbox on the backside of the engine, under the fuel tank to the front cowling hidden behind mesh.

The idea is that as the bike speeds up, the air is forced through ducts on the front of the bikes causing a sort of 'turbo' effect.

We are talking here though of quite high speeds to see any real kind of pressure difference or forced induction effect on the bike and for bikes used on the road is more of a gimmick because you'll never reach the speeds (legaly) on the road to be able to use it.

Kev · # 8 06-08-10, 13:44

The problem with a Auto Tune you can't see in real time the A/F ratio like the wide band commander does, the Wideband Commander also allows for full data logging of the A/F ratio.

The Wideband Commander does not build your fuel map like the auto tune does. The Auto Tune can only be used with a PCV, the wide band commander can be used on any bike or car no matter what type of fuel injection or carby you have.

Wideband Commander
http://www.hardracing.com/misc/wideband.htm

Auto Tune
http://www.powercommander.com/powercommander/Products/AutoTune/powercommander_autotune.aspx

If I was to buy a new A/F meter I would go for a Wideband Commander 2, the new one is a auto tune as well as A/F ratio meter to see real time A/F ratio, it can't data log like the Wideband commander 1 which I have.

http://www.dynojetwb2.com/

dazmatic · # 9 06-08-10, 16:16

Kev..

Here's something that'll interest you.

I've just been for a ride after installing my switch.

Now, bare in mind that as far as I know, my AIS is blocked off with insulation tape and before installing my new switch, I had a ****ty switch attached under the seat and was always on.
So as far as I was aware, the autotune was constantly making and applying trim adjustments when I was riding untill I turned the bike off in which all the trims were lost as I was unable to turn the switch off as it was under the seat.

Now, after going for a ride just now, with the autotune on, I noticed I had some severe surging lower down in the rpm range, I'm talking bucking bronco!

But as soon as I turned it off, it was fine, no bucking no surging, nothing.

Edit:
Just got off the Phone to dynojet UK.
Apparently, when the switch is off, the autotune is off and does nothing, makes no changes to the map or trim.
When the switch is on, the autotune is on and makes changes to the trim table and applies them on top of the base map, but makes no changes to the base map.
When you then switch the autotune off after its been on, it doesn't make any changes to the base map either.

All of which is different to what the manual says!

So I took to listening instead, and down a quiet road, rode along at around 25mph in 3rd and I could hear the AIS clicking open and close. What I found was if like this, I had the autotune off, no bucking.
Soon as I turned it on, it started bucking again... pretty much in time with the AIS clicking!!

So what does this tell me?

Well, I've not touched my AIS for sometime but I think it may not be as blocked off as I thought, because if the autotune is on then its taking readings and applying them in real time. If the AIS isn't blocked, it'd screw with the autotunes readings causing it to surge with the AIS.

However, I asked myself, if the AIS isn't blocked, how long has it been like it i I haven't touched it for some time? Why didn't it do it before when the autotune was on all the time?
Maybe it wasn't... maybe the switch I used before was defunct and didn't work? or wasn't on? It was fairly old...

So... to troubleshoot, I shall re-double my AIS blocking off technique and make sure nothing can get through.

Any ideas for making sure its deffinately blocked off?

dazmatic · # 10 06-08-10, 17:55

ahaa...

Ais pipe wasn't on properly.
Don't think when I blocked it originally that I'd put the hose back on and that it was just hanging on the edge, including the spring clip and must have just come off over time.

Had another thought Kev, didn't you say that I'm the only person you know who has got a PCV AND an Autotune?

I only wonder because technically, if when the O2 sensor is disconnected and normal eliminator is applied, the ECU changes the AFR between lean and rich at points below 20% throttle between 2500 and 6000 rpm.

Well, technically, if the ECU is doing that, and the autotune is switched on and monitoring the AFR in real time, and making trim changes in real time and applying them whilst your riding, surely the Autotune will counteract that?

So, as the ECU changes to rich, the autotune will lean it out because it'll see the AFR change in real time.

Granted, the map will be very, very messy because of it being all over the show, however, the autotune should do its job and keep the AFR at a constant when riding so no actual surging will be shown by the bike despite the ECU change.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode