Time For A New Chain & Sprocket Kit
 

Guys

My OEM chain is on its way out. Signs of wear and there is a noticable tight spot when the rear wheel is off the ground during lubing. Sprockets are good but i think I am getting close to changing the lot to new. Couple of questions if I may:

1. Regarding removing the old chain is there a right and a wrong way?
2. Do the new chains come with a split link or do I need to invest in some kind of tool to close the new chain onto the bike?
3. Finally I have had a look through the posts in this part of the forum, does anyone know from experience what make to go for.

Thank you.

If you buy your drive kit from B&C Express they will send you the 2 sprockets in the standard sizes i.e. no alteration from 15/46 unless you ask them for a different gearing and a chain which is the correct number of links. However the chain comes splitted and you will have to borrow a chain tool to lock the pin back and I tell you it is a very hard fit.

The quality of the items sold by B&C Express is superb, these people are the most professional in the field, they can take your phone order and when you talk to them they will advise you on the best quality vs price available for you.

I have been using them for 3 times in a row now in the last 3 years, the kit I have bought from them is called 4172 RE.APX which consists of the following:

The sprockets are both Renthals, you get a stiffened aluminium anodized rear sprocket and a steel front one their chains are Tsubaky X-ring and never had any problems. They last twice as long as the OEM by the way.

• Yamaha XT660 X/R 04-07 (All prices are incl. delivery)

Renthal Sprockets and Tsubaki O Ring
4172.RE.AP
� 84.58


Renthal Sprockets and Tsubaki X Ring Gold
4172.RE.APX
� 89.93


Steel Sprockets and Tsubaki O Ring
4172.ST.AP
� 82.47


Steel Sprockets and Tsubaki X Ring Gold
4172.ST.APX
� 87.83

However I have just ordered a new set myself and this time I have asked them that I want to experiment with an even longer lasting and stronger set, even at the expense of little bit of weight or cash and they have sold me their top of the range rear sporcket which is a Renthal Gold extra strong and a Renthal Y-ring chain, the price came to �114 all in, which is an extra �24 but if they do what they claim i.e. last even longer than their other set, then it's got to be a deal.

Give them a call see what they suggest. A lot of us have used them and are very satisifed with their services.

http://www.bandcexpress.co.uk/cgi-bi...OAD&nav=Yamaha
Scroll to the bottom and you will find their XT660 kits

or call:
B&C Express, Station Road, Potterhanworth, Lincoln, LN4 2DX, ENGLAND
United Kingdom
Telephone from UK: 01522 791369
Fax from UK: 01522 794262
International
Telephone International: +44 1522 791369
Fax International: +44 1522 794262
E-mail: sales@bandcexpress.co.uk
Trading Hours: Monday to Friday: 09:00 to 17:30 GMT

Cheers for that Capt, I will order using your recommendation. I will go for a middle of the road quality and see how much better that is over my OEM's. I will have a scout around for this tool to sort the chain out as I do like to have the right tools for any given job.

Do you have a picture of the tool or am I pushing my luck now?

did you mean 15/45 ?

Scrub that Capt I have found one at M & P for �50. A bit pricey mind but at least I can do the job myself. Will look around for a cheaper riveter but at least I know where I can get one from now.

Cheers.

Try here.

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Delux-H-Duty-...QQcmdZViewItem

Want a stronger one.

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/HEAVY-DUTY-TR...QQcmdZViewItem

Cheers for that Kev. I will have a look at that when I get in from work later tonight. My company blocks Ebay access...

Anyway I have called my local Yamaha dealer CMC Motorcycles in Cannock to get a price for them to supply and fit just for reference. �190 all in. Oh my goodness! that is bad. Looks like B & C Express plus a removal and riveting tool is a bargain. I also would much prefer to do the job myself as the hassle of droping the bike off and collecting etc etc and I enjoy doing bike maintenance as well.

yes sorry 15 front / 45 rear.... :D :hb:

If you get one with different sized pushpins you can use it on all manner of chains including timing chains.The best tip I ever got was,to grind flush the pin you are going to press out,as it makes it easier on the tool...:happy8:

Queue the stoopid questions: I'm sorry but you're going to have to excuse my ignorance on this... so this tool will split the pin on a link, does it have to be a certain pin or any of them? Will the same tool join it back up together? Is this what I would use to remove a link (My new chain is at the furthest setting and still lose)? Are there particular links that are for removing?

I think I need a quick lesson in chain mechanics :icon_confused: :dontknow: :icon_scratch:

Steve, I've just learnt this recently from AJT660, apparently modern chains don't have a split pin anymore, meaning not one you can open and close frequently. Rather they come open with pin that once fitted in place with the tool mentioned above, they can't be opened anymore, so that means when replacing modern chains, these need to be cut, with an angle grinder or other chopping device. (this according to AJT660 Alan)

Cheers

Ah! So what's the solution? Do I need a whole new chain already? This one (although I never had much faith in it's quality � it was a quick solution to a suprise problem on my recent trip) has only been on there for under 2k miles.... I'd be loathed to have to fork out for new chain already. :eusa_boohoo:

I'd like to know more about chains in general though, it looks such a simple concept that I'm sure I should have a better grasp on it than merely lubing them regularly.

try this test.
Adjust the chjain to the correct slack and then see if you can pull it away from the rear sprocket, if you can, then the chain is worn, also does it flow freely around or does it form little V's meaning the links stick and not extend freely? that is another sign of badness cause I would expect it does that since it jumped off your sprockets on the stella alpina trip.

I have adjusted it to the maximum adjustness. It is uncomfortably close to pulling free from the rear sprocket (but not quite there) and there is no 'V's forming although it does look like it's hanging when I'm not sat on it. It didn't jump off the sprocket on my Stella Trip � it snapped, this chain is the replacement I managed to source en-route.

If I were to cut a link and make it shorter, would I have to cut two and then source a new joining pin?

Not sure Kev might know that detail.

It is possible to drill two pins out from consecutive links if you have a drill stand and vice. You would then need to get a new pin and 'rivet' it to rejoin. Remember the 'rivetting' is not to expand the pin inside the link connection as with normal rivets but to 'round' the end to form a burr over which the link side cannot pass. That is why a special tool is used and a special pin with 'hard' length and 'soft' ends to be peened.

If you are not comfortable with this some engineering shops will do it.

You would be a lucky man if you could drill a chain link.

If you want to make your chain shorter, find the rivet link on the chain & grind off the heads. Remove as many links as you need & make sure the wheel is all the way forward in adjustment. Renew the rivet link.

One thing I have learned in life, buy the strongest chain you can & no 2 chains are the same, you get what you pay for. I replaced my chain & sprockets the other day & used a RK Chain 520 GXW Gold (XW Ring) chain cost over 100 Pounds

If you can pull the chain away from the sprocket and only done 2000 miles with it then I would say you have the wrong chain on the bike.

I'm no expert though but as you live in Surrey you could try my mechanical friend Kev in Woking who has his own bike garage. Try calling him. 01483 751828 Best time today would be this afternoon as he's out at the moment re-stocking. He might even do it for ya. Can't see him charging too much as I've watched him change a chain in a couple of minutes.

I'm booked in for this Saturday as he's giving my bike a service. If he could book you in then we could meet up and also oggle at the 700 Raptor he's getting in.

He'll put you straight for sure. Don't forget to say Mike sent ya.

Somethings to read up on chains. As I said not all chains are the same.

http://www.rk-excel.co.jp/english/te...pec_200406.gif

http://www.rk-excel.co.jp/english/tech1.htm

http://www.rk-excel.co.jp/english/tech6.htm

http://www.rk-excel.co.jp/english/tech5.htm

Guys I am glad we started this thread. For such a basic or you would think basic item like a bike chain I have certainly learned loads of info on this. As Kev says I think I am gonna get the best chain I can afford just like the Capt as well, if these things fail then you are stranded and seriously p****ed off! Let alone any resultant off you may have from the potential lock up...

Given the choice I would have fitted the best... alas, on the side of a French motorway I found myself with few options.

I will be able to buy a new rivet link then? I'm sure that would be much cheaper than a new chain for now... at least until I can afford a new chain and sprocket (only the chain was replaced � ideally I would have swapped them all out together. I imagine that a new chain on old sprockets is not ideal). What does the rivet link look like or is it obvious (i.e. the odd one out)?

What are the basic do's and don't's? ... I wouldn't want to do anything stoopid... again... :dontknow:

I just had a chat with my mechanical buddy and he told me that there is a lot of cheap sh|t on the market and best not go near 'em especially if your gonna put it on an XT as they are likely to stretch the chain more so than a 4 cylinder machine due to the nature of a great big thumping single.

You definately get what you pay for when it comes to chains. Best bet is to buy a kit with chain and sprockets together. Spend more and it'll save you money in the end.

I quite agree. Normally, anything for my beloved (consumables etc.) I go for the best. This chain cost me 70 Euro's and has since failed to instill any confidence in it's production. Thing is, the trip left a rather substantial dent in my wallet and the wife's having kittens over it. If I've any hope of ever going out for fun on the XT again I've gotta work to budget... at least for a while if you know what I mean :bricks:

Sounds like your replacement chain was too long & should have been shortened before it was fitted.As KEV said when you are fitting a new chain,push the back wheel as far forward as it will go,wrap the chain around the sprockets,bring the ends together & see how much overlap you have(this is how many links you have to remove).To remove the exsisting chain use a chain breaker/riveter, not an anglegrinder as the sparks can burn things &/or you could slip & do some real damage.My advice would be,get an old chain & have some practice.Once you've done it a couple of times you'll find it quite easy...:happy8:

or you could cut the chain off with an angle grinder and find that the new one you have been sent is not correct, and you are 50 miles from home at your mates workshop.......

:smilies0979:

Our metalwork teacher showed us the technique and made us all drill out a bicycle chain (we all had bicycles in those days) in metalwork class. By now there must be thousands of lucky men from my school alone. http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/18/18_5_6.gif

It does sound like that and it certainly looks like that hanging there like a hookers knicker elastic!

Some good news though, it is the type of chain that has the whole split pin rivetty thing. A mechanically minded mate of mine has had a look at it yesterday and is going to lend me the neccersary tools for me to c0ck it up... from that point it will be and RAC job to my local garage but I do like to try these things � it's the only way to learn. You never know, I may actually understand his instructions, remove a link or two AND put the chain back together without incident!

I am still intenting to change my chain AND sprockets for a decent set, I just need this cr@ppy chain to see me out the next month. Wish me luck.

Steve I've noticed yesterday when I saw your bike in Golden Sq. that the lenght of your 2 adjusters rods at the back of your swingarm are really stretched out to the max which suggest you are running a longer chain than it should be.

Not that my opinion is worth much but I wouldnt risk it. I wouldnt ride it if there was any dout in my mind about the chain not being correct. Borrow the money and get a new one mate, just in case it snaps or something.
:ytiller:

Tell us how it is done oh metalwork master.......:Knitting_22PFUP:

This pupil says (from memory - easier to do than to describe):-

1. Ensure all normal safety rules followed - clear work area, goggles, machines safety guards etc.

2. Select bit approximately 2/3 diameter of pin to be drilled.

3. Clamp chain in vice below drill stand with pin to be drilled below bit.

4. Use drill stand movements to centre drill bit over pin.

5. 'Square' or 'level' end of pin with metal file.

6. Use centre punch to locate bit when applied.

7. Drill to just below lower edge of upper pin link (to relieve pin).

8. Change bit to countersink bit.

9. Drill counter sink bit to just above top edge of upper pin link.

10. Support link on billet with core hole slightly larger than the lower pin head.

11. Use parallel punch to tap out pin.

This was before the days of angle grinders - but it worked.

A blunted knitting needle might have been the right size to insert in the appropriate place.

With apologies to Mr. Blount if he still lives for any errors/omissions in the above.

Can anyone tell me the difference between X ring and O ring?

An X ring chain has a seal ring between the side plates shaped like an X in cross sectoin.
An O ring chain has a seal ring between the side plates shaped like an O in cross section.

I think the idea of the X ring is it seals the same as an O ring chain but has less friction so more power goes to the back wheel.

Hope that helps.

Does anyone know how many links is standard on an XT chain i assume its universal?

Whats the difference in wear between alloy and steel sprockets? Is it just a difference in weight as opposed to any performance gains.

also anyone read this: http://www.quality-cycle.com/truth_a...cle_chains.htm

just read that last link on chains,,as i need one,, thanks that guy.... it has to be x ring now...